Low-end automatics: Seiko 5 -vs- Orient -vs- Poljot

[none]

I'm considering the purchase of a low-end automatic watch (<=$100), and
I've noticed that Seiko, Orient, and Poljot seem to be the main brands
available on the web/ebay in this price range.

Does it make any difference which brand I buy, or are they all pretty
much the same?

Thanks,
-Mike

[Honest John]

A Poljot with a 3133 mevement is hard to beat for the $$.

Post by none
I'm considering the purchase of a low-end automatic watch (<=$100), and
I've noticed that Seiko, Orient, and Poljot seem to be the main brands
available on the web/ebay in this price range.
Does it make any difference which brand I buy, or are they all pretty
much the same?
Thanks,
-Mike

[Jack Denver]

I think you have them in about the right order - Seiko is a giant
corporation that has vast resources to buy the latest robotized tooling and
this show thru in the consistency of their watches, among whom there is
rarely a dud. A Poljot made on a good day is a good watch, but on a not so
good day the watch may stop inexplicably, leak, etc. - it says something
that the higher line Poljots now have ETA movmements. Note that I'm not
referring to their chronographs - they are literally without competition in
the low end mechronograph category. Also do not omit the Citizen/Miyota
movement as found in the Invicta and others - this movement winds from the
crown unlike the Seiko/Orient .

But really you can't go too far wrong with any of these.

Post by none
I'm considering the purchase of a low-end automatic watch (<=$100), and
I've noticed that Seiko, Orient, and Poljot seem to be the main brands
available on the web/ebay in this price range.
Does it make any difference which brand I buy, or are they all pretty
much the same?
Thanks,
-Mike

[Eric Jorgensen]

On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 16:45:16 -0400

Post by Jack Denver
I think you have them in about the right order - Seiko is a giant
corporation that has vast resources to buy the latest robotized tooling
and this show thru in the consistency of their watches, among whom there
is rarely a dud. A Poljot made on a good day is a good watch, but on a
not so good day the watch may stop inexplicably, leak, etc. - it says
something that the higher line Poljots now have ETA movmements. Note
that I'm not referring to their chronographs - they are literally without
competition in the low end mechronograph category. Also do not omit the
Citizen/Miyota movement as found in the Invicta and others - this
movement winds from the crown unlike the Seiko/Orient .

Brings up something I'm wondering about recently. Since my 'russian'
skeleton watch has a chinese movement, chinese case, and chinese bracelet.
Looks like I'm going to have to buy a Vostok, a Slava, or a Poljot to get
an actual communist on my wrist, and I'm not interested in a Vostok or
Slava.

Some of the poljot chronos have a 31679 movement in them, last few
years. These typically have three subdials, sometimes "moonphase" (really
day/night indicator). Poljot says it's an "upgraded" 3133.

Any comments? I haven't found a review of the cal. 31679.

- Eric

[Revision]

I have tried Poljot, and have to say that the rock-solid performance of
the Seiko is amazing. Japan has basically mastered the design and
execution of precision mechanical devices. I am not even tempted to go
with an ETA Swiss quartz because I feel that it could only be "as good
as" a similar Seiko device.

Here is a special edition Seiko 7S26 at PMWF. The case looks like it
might have come off the Seiko Kinetic line. I told Reto this and now he
has added it to the description. :) A little larger than the smallish
Seiko 5. This 39.5 mm model is a very nice size. I plan to get one if
the white dial is back in stock, though the black dial is ok too.

PMWF link:
http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES02/Seiko5DragonBlackSNK117KJan04/Seiko5DragonBlackSNK117KPoseidonJan04.htm

http://makeashorterlink.com/?W15721EF8

PMWF Seiko page including "Kinetic cased" Seiko 5s

http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES/SeikoSalesTable.htm

http://makeashorterlink.com/?D28712EF8

roachman.com has some nice Seiko, Orient, Titoni as well.

[Revision]

For some reason the pics of the 39.5mm Poseidon make it look huge. It is
a normal sized watch.

[Jack Denver]

One of the things that is a shame about Seiko is that they seem to have
discontinued their mid level mechanical calibers - either you have the very
plebian 7S26 (a nice movement but about as cheap as you can get) which they
case variously from very cheap Seiko 5s all the way to $200 divers. Then
the next step up ( a big one) seems to be the ultra pricey Grand Seiko and
Credor. It's as if GM had only Chevy and Cadillac. Up until about 4 yrs ago
they had a mid level hi- beat movement, the 4S15, comparable to (or perhaps
even nicer than) ETA 28 series, with crown winding & hacking but these have
disappeared and are now collectibles. I don't know how well they actually
perform but in the pictures it sure looks well made with an etachron style
fine regulator and 3 count 'em 3 diashocks - 1 on the balance and 2 more on
what? the reversing wheels for the auto train?

Some pictures here:
http://alanwatch.homestead.com/seiko.html

None of these watches, BTW are imported into the US by Seiko, which sells
100% quartz here. Any one that makes it over here is gray market.

Post by Revision
I have tried Poljot, and have to say that the rock-solid performance of
the Seiko is amazing. Japan has basically mastered the design and
execution of precision mechanical devices. I am not even tempted to go
with an ETA Swiss quartz because I feel that it could only be "as good
as" a similar Seiko device.
Here is a special edition Seiko 7S26 at PMWF. The case looks like it
might have come off the Seiko Kinetic line. I told Reto this and now he
has added it to the description. :) A little larger than the smallish
Seiko 5. This 39.5 mm model is a very nice size. I plan to get one if
the white dial is back in stock, though the black dial is ok too.

http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES02/Seiko5DragonBlackSNK117KJan04/Seiko5DragonBlackSNK117KPoseidonJan04.htm

Post by Revision
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W15721EF8
PMWF Seiko page including "Kinetic cased" Seiko 5s
http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES/SeikoSalesTable.htm
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D28712EF8
roachman.com has some nice Seiko, Orient, Titoni as well.

[H. Doug Matsuoka]

Yes, I join you in lamenting the disappearance of the 4S movements. I'd have
a bunch of 7S26 Seikos if the would only hack and wind, and I'd be willing to
pay a reasonable premium too. Oh well, as it is I guess I have to go with
the ETA 2824, which is a fine movement -- not complaining about it. I just
wish there were a Seiko alternative to make things more interesting and fun.

Post by Jack Denver
One of the things that is a shame about Seiko is that they seem to have
discontinued their mid level mechanical calibers - either you have the very
plebian 7S26 (a nice movement but about as cheap as you can get) which they
case variously from very cheap Seiko 5s all the way to $200 divers. Then
the next step up ( a big one) seems to be the ultra pricey Grand Seiko and
Credor. It's as if GM had only Chevy and Cadillac. Up until about 4 yrs ago
they had a mid level hi- beat movement, the 4S15, comparable to (or perhaps
even nicer than) ETA 28 series, with crown winding & hacking but these have
disappeared and are now collectibles. I don't know how well they actually
perform but in the pictures it sure looks well made with an etachron style
fine regulator and 3 count 'em 3 diashocks - 1 on the balance and 2 more on
what? the reversing wheels for the auto train?
http://alanwatch.homestead.com/seiko.html
None of these watches, BTW are imported into the US by Seiko, which sells
100% quartz here. Any one that makes it over here is gray market.

Post by Revision
I have tried Poljot, and have to say that the rock-solid performance of
the Seiko is amazing. Japan has basically mastered the design and
execution of precision mechanical devices. I am not even tempted to go
with an ETA Swiss quartz because I feel that it could only be "as good
as" a similar Seiko device.
Here is a special edition Seiko 7S26 at PMWF. The case looks like it
might have come off the Seiko Kinetic line. I told Reto this and now he
has added it to the description. :) A little larger than the smallish
Seiko 5. This 39.5 mm model is a very nice size. I plan to get one if
the white dial is back in stock, though the black dial is ok too.

http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES02/Seiko5DragonBlackSNK117KJan04/Seiko5
DragonBlackSNK117KPoseidonJan04.htm

Post by Revision
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W15721EF8
PMWF Seiko page including "Kinetic cased" Seiko 5s
http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES/SeikoSalesTable.htm
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D28712EF8
roachman.com has some nice Seiko, Orient, Titoni as well.

[none]

Post by Revision
I have tried Poljot, and have to say that the rock-solid performance of
the Seiko is amazing.

Hi,

Thanks a lot to everyone for their help and advice! I picked out a Seiko
similar to the one you showed me, but with a standard bracelet
connector instead of the integrated metal strap:
(<http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES02/LongSkirtedCaseSeiko5SNK381KArabBlackOct03/Seiko5SNK381KBlackArabsOct03.htm>).


Unfortunately, I continued to browse the pmwf website anyway, and the
gods contrived to punish my curiosity by showing me one of the
best-looking watches I've ever seen:
(<http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES/BorelBlackDayDateAutoJan03/BorelBlackMilitaryDayDate.htm>)

So, I spent nearly twice my original budget, for a watch that's nowhere
near Seiko in price/performance -- for only $20 more, I could've gotten
one of those nifty Seiko Superiors with sapphire crystal. Unfortunately,
once you've fallen in love, it's difficult to objectively consider the
benefits of upgrading to a superior model

Oh, well...my next watch will be a Seiko, as long as the Borel doesn't
feel too jealous.

Thanks,
-Mike

[Revision]

"none" >

Post by none
Oh, well...my next watch will be a Seiko, as long as the Borel doesn't
feel too jealous.

The Seiko has a lot going for it.....the longer lugs of the current
production, white digits on black background for the calendar, pushbutton
clasp, and a somewhat heavier than usual band. So the Seiko would not
have been a bad choice.

The Borel is a thin 10mm which is a plus. The Chinese half of the
calendar points to Borel's history of including the Asia market, Swiss
mvmt and signed crown for what seems a fair price....

Reto is a little bit dogged as the Bangkok Watch World 2004 is on this
week. Here is his initial report:

http://www.pmwf.com/cgi-bin/Forum/webbbs_config.cgi?noframes;read=329606

http://makeashorterlink.com/?D21D22FF8

[Revision]

"Revision"

Post by Revision
So the Seiko would not
have been a bad choice.

Oh okay you got both....never mind.

Here is one I am looking at...196 kHz quartz, GMT, titanium, ten year
battery, and lest I forget perpetual calendar. Goof grief. Looks
similar to one they call the Alpinist.

http://www.pmwf.com/Watches/WATCHSALES02/SEIKOTiPerpCalGMTCal8F56Jan04/SEIKOTiPerpCalGMTSLT043P.htm

http://makeashorterlink.com/?U2F854E98

[asdf]

Don't know about Orient but a Seiko 5 can be had for as little as $30.
Unbeatable value and a reliable, time-proved performer any way you slice it.
It may well become the most successful model in history, the VW bug of
automatic watches.

Poljot are not that cheap and their quality is a crap-shot, with lemons
being the rule rather than the exception. I've had one of their Fortis
clones that fell apart after 3 months, bad luck I guess. Worth buying only
for some insights into a system that promised mankind the moon and could not
deliver a decent wristwatch.

[Revision]

"asdf" >

Post by asdf
Poljot are not that cheap and their quality is a crap-shot, with lemons
being the rule rather than the exception.

Wow...now you tell me. I got a manual wind Volmax Sturmanskie with the
re-introduced 2628, and two weeks later the winder went all crunchy on
me. It is somewhere between here and Moscow now. If you get a good one
they last a long time and keep good time....now $99 and
russiansouvenirs.com pays for the shipping..

http://home.arcor.de/michael.fokkens/html/poljot_sturmanskie1.html

http://www.russiansouvenirs.com/

I should have gone for Volmax's new favorite movement, the 31 jewel 2432
auto.

http://vostok-europe.us/vostok.htm